what size lionel transformer do i need what size lionel transformer do i need

40-500 50 Watt AC Transformer - 50 Watt AC transformer suitable for . If you need a device that converts from different voltages so it can power another device, then a transformer will fulfill that role perfectly. With the ever-increasing amount of small electronics in today's sophisticated models, this protection is more important than ever. Never Enough Room, Time or Money for all the Trains! This wire is very fine and can be found in many color combinations. Actually it was a train show with varied trains of all different eras being run I have mostly MTH trains though and they wouldn't run because the transformer that was running wasn't powerful enough to cycle through my MTH trainsounds. Make sure you are getting the right type of power supply for your layout. (10 lights X . Just connect the jumper wires to the same connections on the back of your transformer as your original connections, and make sure that the wires are not crossed. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. 12V DC to 120V AC 60Hz pure sine inverter. LGB throttles 51070, 52120 and 52121 will all work with the 50061 and other LGB transformers. The Lionel ZW has four sets of posts and six controls. It can be a great secondary power supply for lighted buildings, signals, and other accessories. Good choices are the Lionel 32923 Accessory Transformer, or another 80-watt transformer like the one included in your set, #14198. From 25 Watts to 275 Watts, a Lionel transformer could be found for every power requirment from simple circles of track to extensive railroads. How to open tamper resistant outlets, Xxcopy vs Xcopy: Command line copy utilities, Where to connect the red wire to a light switch, Brains 25 cents: The story behind the meme. It is also a good idea to run your accessories off of a separate power supply and wire grid from the trains themselves. If you plan to add a second loop for another train in the near future, the 14198 would be a wise investment. It's expensive, but the same factors that drove KW prices down are also driving ZW prices down. The power supply that comes with these sets is usually a very small wall pack plug-in that cannot be easily expanded. Keep the power supplies in an area where they get plenty of air circulation to prevent overheating. 10 Easy Ways to Improve a Christmas Train Display, Compatibility of Different Model Train Brands, How to Build and Wire Reverse Loops for Model Trains, Wiring a Model Railroad for Block Operation, Wire Gauge Standards for Model Train Layouts, Model Train Track Grades and Maximum Grade Issues. All Lionel transformer comparisons should include the common 1033, RW, LW, KW and ZW transformers. If you have a very long run, you may want to consider Number 12 wire. Use the CW-80 Transformer only for its intended purpose. In addition to the wire itself, connectors like crimp-on terminals and terminal blocks must also be purchased in larger (and more expensive) sizes. If the transformer fails, you most likely have a short or overload somewhere in the control circuit. The smaller of the two is #12028, which turns your oval into this: There is also the larger 12031 plan, which has a couple extra straight track pieces included, creating this: Even better, one or more of the expansion sets can be combined to create even more interesting track layouts. The typ miniature incandecents we use average about 100 ma of current each. Extending the Reach of Your Power From 25 Watts to 275 Watts, a Lionel transformer could be found for every power requirment from simple circles of track to extensive railroads. I'm sure I'll need more help along the way, so I'll be checking back in with more silly questions! Here are some simple definitions for these electrical terms: Most power supplies will be labeled as to the scales they are meant to handle. It states: 1.25 amps for each motor, 0.2 amps for each bulb. properly wired transformer can handle any amount of track. Just get a Lionel #12053 Accessory wire set and enough extra wire to connect from the wire set back to your transformer [speaker wire works well]. ransformers were issued by Lionel thoughout the Post War period. Which Lionel transformer do I need? you ask? Starter set locomotives can pull up to 12 cars easily, and most can handle up to 20, so building a longer train will not harm your engine. Will get a Z4000 one day [this summer probably, unless I find a good deal on an older ZW] just to say I have one. That transformer will only prolly handle 1 engine and depending on how long it is will depend on how many extra feeders you will need around the layout. Lionel is also introducing a new 180 watt transformer to accompany the 80 watt CW 80. Mark. Fortunately, in the early 21st century it is easier to expand your starter set than ever before. Because of this, like with lighting and accessories, your power supply and wiring for switch machines do not need to be as robust. Obviously, for a lot of people, the $700 Lionel ZW-L transformer is overkill. To participate you must either login or register for an account. The Best Technical and Innovative Podcasts you should Listen, Essay Writing Service: The Best Solution for Busy Students, 6 The Best Alternatives for WhatsApp for Android, The Best Solar Street Light Manufacturers Across the World, Ultimate packing list while travelling with your dog. When they were manufactured by The American Flyer Manufacturing Company, they were made in Standard Gauge and a version of "O" gauge. Interested in southest Pennsylvania railroads; The farther from the transformer the more resistance in the rails and your engine will slow down. Lionel Trains|MTH Train|Lionel Train Sets| HO model Trains| G Scale|Dept 56 Problem with Rail King Protocol Sounds reversing unit, My D-190 Back in Action After Move to to NC, Caboose Identification - late era vintage, Continuing Saga Newtown Hardwrare House WIP. Price Received. My question is.how big of a transformer will I need to power this thing? HO trains are very durable and are made with high quality parts and pieces to ensure the longevity of the Lionel train brand! Serious or fatal injuries may result. The Lionel RW also happens to be a great transformer for Marx or American Flyer trains too, when you connect the track leads to the B and U posts instead of the A and U posts youd normally use for most Lionel setups. If you continue to use this site we will assume that you are happy with it. EXPLORE FasTrack 10" Straight Track 4-Pack 6-12032 $ 21.99 FasTrack Grade Crossing with Flashers 6-12052 $ 99.99 FasTrack O36 Curved Track 4-Pack 6-12033 $ 21.99 Legacy AMC-2 Motor Controller As your layout grows beyond the basic oval of track that comes with most starter sets, a good power distribution network is essential to getting consistent performance from your train all the way around. As your layout grows so, too, will its power demand. I will make a note here. JavaScript is disabled. This is interesting stuff. The wire can also be purchased as solid or stranded. Then the K's will do siding and switching yard duty. Like command control, these trains still require a constant voltage to the rails. DCC decoders are one good example where the wire colors are critical. DCC is less common in starter sets, but some are available. We use a ZW 275 and a KW on this, so 405 watts. If you want to connect ten landscape lights to a magnetic transformer, and the lights use 30 watts each, you would need a 375 watt transformer. Members enjoy 15% off any purchase in our store. God bless TCA 05-58541 Benefactor Member of theNRA, Member of the American Legion, Retired Boss Hog of Roseyville , KC&D Qualified. They have everything you need for a basic setup, and the larger ones are capable of running the smaller layouts you see in the train magazines, so they have some room for growth. Willoughby, Ohio - the home of the CP & E RR. If you want a spur track to store an extra car or two, Lionel makes another expansion set [#12044] that does just that: Note that this set includes one switch which is the track section that makes the track diverge onto two separate routes. This type of transformer is cheap, its reliable, and its easy to find. Viola, DCS on alternate power blocks, Max signal, Happiness. The customer will still need a step down transformer to get the 220V to 110V. I thought you wanted information related to your layout not operations at a trains show. A 10 amp breaker and 16 gauge wire would be appropriate for an old ZW. To build on the point you are running MTH trains and therefore will probably go DCS eventually: I would break the track into blocks of about 5 feet in length. These can all have uses for your layout. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. Lionel makes two expansion sets for this purpose. The 190-wattLionel KWwas the second biggest and second best transformer of the postwar era. Then power every other one with one of your smaller transformers. This would be more than enough for any single train and a few accessories. The choice of a control system is somewhat, but not necessarily, dependent on which manufacturers engines you prefer or have the most of. While better starter sets usually include a more robust transformer, as a general rule the power pack supplied with your starter set is just thata start. The greatest transformer Lionel made in the postwar era was the 270 watt Lionel ZW. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. This signifies compatibility with 50 Hertz power. QUOTE: by Skyray "Typical engineer--you need a technician. Do not connect this product to any other power supply. Heavier insulation not only adds to the cost of the wire but also makes it harder to bend. Trainz carries a variety of books that build upon the information listed above. But if you already have a 1034 and dont need a whistle button, go ahead and use it. The Lionel 1033 is a great choice for small or medium-sized layouts. My question is this in order that this doesn't happen again what type of transformer would you recommend? HO gauge is very popular because of its size. The 1033 is not the same as the 1044. --Heck, watching one train run is great, Ill bet TWO would be even more fun! "What size wire should I use?" I recently acquired a beautiful Lionel NH Alco 420. While those locomotives and their sound systems are designed to operate using conventional transformers like your ZW, digital controllers are needed to activate additional features like special sound effects and coupler activation. Dave, you're so eloquent and inspiring - my undergraduate degree was in American Studies, now I'm in charge of among other things all our college's technology - also self-taught.. Hello All: Re: Dave Farquhar, Dave you left out sense of humor Regards Steve. If you were to get a ZW 275 you need external short protection. You don't want to try to solder even Number 16 gauge wire right to your rails, however. (8 lights X 20 watts = 160 watts). This is different from the stranded wire in that the different individual wires, each with their color-coded insulation, is placed inside a secondary insulation wrap. Price Received. Lionel Trains Pocket Price Guide 1901-2022. When you get DCS, keep the blocks and run the 2 sets off 2 Fixed channels out. However, in the future if you continue in the hobby and your roster expands you may acquire motive power which requires larger curves than what came with your set. By clicking Accept All Cookies, you agree to the storing of cookies on your device to enhance site navigation, analyze site usage, and assist in our marketing efforts. Yes, but the train will probably run too fast, depending on the output voltage of the transformer. You can use bus and feeder wires to more evenly distribute the power over your track. To my knowledge, you should have no compatibility issues with a pure sine wave track feed with any major brand locomotive. Can't plug into outlet? I've got around 320 ft of track between all of the mainline, sidings, etc and I don't have any problems running my engines anywhere on the layout. Doug Murphy 'We few, we happy few, we band of brothers' Henry V. I am a person with a very active inner child. Transformers are designed to fail if a short in the secondary or control side occurs. Adding lights to buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories usually do not require anywhere near the amperage demand of the trains themselves. Besides the train and track, accessories provide a lot of fun and animation to any setup. The accessory activation track (#12029) is used to activate Lionel trackside accessories. I run an MTH 4-6-2 PS-1 pulling five Madisons on about fifty feet of track and the transformer I am using (Z-4000) has a digital amp readout. . The next evolution in model train control is radio- or bluetooth-controlled trains. It would be advantageous if OGR magazine would put an article together comparing the major manufacturers transformers output waveform compatibility/ incompatibilitywith the various manufacturer's locomotives - Atlas O, Weaver, 3rd Rail, MTH , Lionel etc and conventional , DCS , TMCC, Legacy command control. Is there anyway of saying how much track it will power? Digital command control systems (DCC) uses digital information to control the electrical power to the train. If you found this post informative or helpful, please share it! All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. You can also run Lionel TMCC/Legacy Command Engines using the MTH DCS system with the addition of a Lionel command base and an additional cable. A small set that came with track, transformer, etc. Remember, the only silly question is the one that you did not ask. Ok our layout is 10 x 20 = 200 sq ft x 2 = 400 watts. the amount of track is not what is important here. The 1044 is just a 1033 in a . Been there, done that. Although all Lionel cars operate on O Gauge track, the bodies of the cars are made in two slightly different sizes. Beginners Ask Trains New trains; old transformers. Lionel CW80's can be found for around $50 at Greenberg and other train shows. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. Some DCC systems also recommend solid wire for certain applications. Here are a few: --The Lionel Fastrack Book, by Robert Schleicher. If you have the proper wire size and a properly-sized circuit breaker, you should not have any problems using the old transformer. He directs production at Lionel, the premier model train manufacturer, and he istheformer president of theConrail HistoricalSociety. Traditionally, Lionel trains run on AC but there are exceptions. Check out my O scale layout progress at MTF, does track consume power? Dang, this math makes my head hurt. Ryan Kunkle is a nationally recognized professional model train expert and writer with over 25 years of experience. Find 500+ popular train rides, museums, and railroad vacation destinations in the U.S and Canada! This is where the Lionel transformer comparisons should begin. Do not operate the CW-80 Transformer with a damaged cord, plug, or case. Although I am an electrical engineer, I just add stuff until the transformer gets too warm and then I branch off and add another. I had 3 lionel cw80's and two quit working. Not really a how-to-build-a-layout book, but it is a good general introduction to the hobby full of interesting stuff. I have noticed that my old transformers do not work well or not work at all with newer electronic whistle tenders. In this case Id go with a postwar TW 175 watt transformer. These bus wires are often more important than the size of the power supply itself in getting good results. These are all good, dependable transformers from the postwar era that are easy to find today, have adequate wattages ranging from 90-270 watts, have a circuit breaker for safety and have a whistle controller. I have a post war ZW and a KW and a Z, all three are good transformers, just meant for differant needs. Checklist Transformer Size Calculator When sizing a transformer, you need to know the kilovolt-amps (KVA) that your machine requires. Sign up for new product releases, promotions, and more. Lionel uses red and black (red always for the center rail, black for the two outer rails) as a standard in its instructions and most 3-Rail O Gauge layouts are probably wired this way. The smaller the number, the larger the wire. For most layouts, and most scales, Number14 stranded wire will work best for your bus. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. The Lionel 1033 is a great choice for small or medium-sized layouts. Today, with some luck, you can get one for closer to $100. Electric Trains make great power supplies, depending on usage, on a DCS controlled layout. There are a few standards when it comes to the color-coding. But it is important to take a close look at the cars to make sure that they are a good match for your set. Max Watts on one TIU is 720W. Scale cars almost always have the number 7 as the second digit in their number [17623, 27241, etc]. Many manufacturers assemble cases with special screws to prevent access to the inside and accidental shock. I have one R transformer from which I run everything - but only 1 train at a time and a few accessories for a layout in a space about 24 by 10 ft. Ive written more about the Lionel ZW here. They give a great deal of power in a single handled transformer, and if you run trains along with another person, it can be more convenient for you to both have a smaller transformer than for two people to huddle around a larger KW or ZW transformer and share its handles. For instance, a 100 kilovolt-ampere transformer with 8.32 kilovolts (or less) on the high side has a typical value of 2.6% impedance. As the kit grows and you start putting in turnouts (or the point switching systems) to move your train from one track to another track, you will not only need more than 1 transformer, you will. (Use buss/feeder lines to distribute power.) Effort. Over the years I have collected boxed(mostly liquor boxes) sets from attics.So I have a variety of transformers on hand. A locomotive on a mile-long loop will draw as many amps as it does on a 4x8 platform. As time goes on you can add higher wattage bricks one by one. He directs production at Lionel, the premier model train manufacturer, and he istheformer president of theConrail HistoricalSociety. I've had light 'arguments' with fellow hobbyists claiming most of their fellows are predominantly technically - oriented vs. what I would consider is a more liberal artsy approach - any way it's a great balance. What does a Lionel transformer do? (NEW/LIKE NEW), running TMCC And DCS engines with DCS handheld, terrible crash in Greece, multiple fatalities, Its.Public Delivery Track ..NEWSpecial run corner, Improving Appearance of 0-gauge Tubular Track. In either case, however, voltage and amperage draw is low and peak for only brief periods. Wire gauges are coded by their size. Accessories often interact with the train, such as a crossing gate that lowers as the train passes. That said, if youre uncomfortable fixing a transformer, I wont look down on you for buying one someone else fixed up. 10 Easy Ways to Improve a Christmas Train Display, Wiring a Model Railroad for Block Operation, How to Build and Wire Reverse Loops for Model Trains, How to Choose the Right Transformer for Your Model Trains, Compatibility of Different Model Train Brands, HO Scale Track Plans for Model Train Layouts, buildings, streets, and other scenic accessories. Dave: That certainly qualifies, don't forget the anti-gun lobbyist with the picket sign's. The fraction of your transformer's power lost in the track will therefore be well under 10 percent, since it is proportional to the voltage drop. View More! Actually the choice of transformer is secondary to the choice of control systems since you can operate O gauge trains with most any good modern transformer. I think the RW is a bit better value, but that could just be timing. It has FasTrack connectors on one end and O Gauge track pins on the other. But were talking the trains that are in the absolute best condition and might not have ever run on the track. Within that range, it is generally recommended to go for the most robust power supply possible. You must be signed in to continue. Lionel 1033 90 watt Transformer Postwar from 1950s-60s Whistle, Direction. Multi-conductor wires with many strands of finer wire are more common for telecommunications and electronics. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. Now, I am going to make a suggesstion that you use a larger diameter curve for your corners. Get the newest photos, videos, stories, and more from Trains.com brands. I recently read an article/product review in the OGR magazine for the new Lioneltransformerand wassurprisedto learn that not all voltage outputwave-formsare created equal (pure sine wave versus some type of clipped sine wave). what size lionel transformer do i need. If the voltage drop in the track is more than a small fraction of the transformer voltage, that is, a volt or two, you are going to have trouble running the trains anyway. In the middle range, Lionel made a lot of other transformers. Not wanting to give up, I experimented with an 80 watt modern Lionel transformer and got great results. I have a 3amp, 40watt transformer. Although not necessarily a mandated standard, white, black and or red are used for track power on most layouts - if for no other reason than these colors are easiest to find. The larger transformers could operate up to four trains independently. Most two-rail track systems use direct current (DC). So far, I haven't seen any way to do this except to take amp measurements or just wing it and see how hot your transformer gets. To determine the required transformer VA, multiply the secondary voltage by the required amperes: For example, VA=Volts x Amperes or 28V x 1.2 amperes = 33.6 VA. To determine the maximum transformer current, divide the transformer VA by transformer secondary voltage. :-). Lionel, LLC continued to manufacture and market trains and accessories in O scale under the Lionel brand and S gauge under the American Flyer brand. Service/Tested $55.00 1 bid $14.06 shipping 1d 6h LIONEL TYPE (KW) TRAINMASTER TRANSFORMER FOR PARTS OR RESTORATION $17.05 4 bids $19.95 shipping 9h 23m Just like with your track bus and feeders, running an accessory bus of slightly heavier wire to connect to each light or accessory with a smaller feeder is a good plan. I have a basement that offers an 18" concrete ledge that goes around theentire perimeter of the house that lends itself perfectly to a neat layout. All Lionel transformer comparisons should start here. The iconic and legendary 270-wattLionel ZW was the biggest and best transformer Lionel made in the postwar era. This means that they are not exact 1:48 replicas of the real thing but instead are selectively compressed to negotiate the tight turns of regular Lionel track. The other type of cars are the Scale cars, which are exact or near-exact replicas of actual freight cars. However, if you begin adding more than 1 or 2 cars, be sure to get some extra track, or your longer train will be chasing its tail very quickly. How do you choose the right power supply for your model trains? Now, I diconnected that old dinosaur and connected two separate smaller ones which weren't powerful enough to run my Amtrack MTH trains. In most cases, stranded wire is preferred because the multiple threads provide more conductivity and flexibility. Turn on the throttle, then short the A and U posts (in the case of Lionel) or variable and base posts (in the case of Flyer) with a screwdriver or a piece of wire for a maximum of five seconds. For more realistic operation, you need some kind of speed control (throttle) between the 10340 Automatic Reversing Unit and your transformer. Past,presentand future. If your going to run anything more that what came with the set then you should probably upgrade to something a little bigger. Likewise, if you only want to run one train at a time, you can keep other trains on the track by wiring with blocks, and turning off trains that are not in use. Outdoor railroads are, of course, an exception! Many load and unload freight from specially designed cars as well. What size Lionel transformer do I need? Mike, The size of the transformer is dictated by what you want to run, the more you run the more power you will need. A starter set is the best way to start with the train hobby. [:)]. Sell Your Trains Yourself At Train Shows. They run on O Gauge track, but they are not exact O Scale cars. Are you looking for a product or serviceif so, then read this BEFORE you post! If you're looking to only have one loop with multiple sidings then you'll only need 1 source of power for the whole layout. We use cookies to ensure that we give you the best experience on our website. But after a little while, you will likely want your train to do more, and youll start thinking along these lines: --It sure would be neat if it did more than run in a circle. But Lionel now produces four Track Expansion Sets, which expand this basic loop into something more exciting. If you add a lot of track and find that your train slows down as it gets farther from your transformer, you will need to run jumper wires to the opposite side of your track layout. The Lionel Track & Power catalog is BACK with the latest information for more ways to make your layout even bigger, better and more powerful! Ryan developsmodeltrainlayouts for public andprivate display. Everyone wanted the two-handled, football-shaped, 275-watt powerhouse that was the ZW. That it not to say that there are not engineering formulae to calculate the current draw and thus the wattage, but far and away the easiest method is to measure it. The article you suggest would be a daunting task, as you'd have to gather virtually every known locomotive and transformer! There is the 12030 Figure-8 set, which along with the track included in your set makes your layout into this: Figure-8s are great because they create a crossing, giving the appearance of a railroad junction, they break up the oval, and the parts to create them are relatively cheap. They are fun to have. Our transformer sizing calculator allows you to obtain the minimum single or three-phase transformer size required based on the load you need to power. There have been issues with chopped waveform transformers, i.e. For a classic setup of a single freight train running on a 48 (or smaller) sheet of plywood, a 90-watt Lionel 1033 or 1044 is an excellent choice. It will require a minimum of 108' of track just to do a basic rectangle before I add any switches, etc. For a 300W set up this will cost you about 100. They are fun to have. Get the Classic Toy Trains newsletter delivered to your inbox twice a month, Calculating transformer size for layout size. You could have a poor connection that caused the wire to heat up. Subscribers, sign in to access exclusive content. I am currently running about 40 bulbs, which at 0.1 A each total 4 amps! Effort. Classic Toy Trains magazine offers information about toy trains operating and collecting, toy train product news and reviews, toy train layout tips, toy train layout designs and track plans, and more. I cant see you needing more than a capacity of 5 amps. Forgot about light bulbs since I don't got some yet. If youre comfortable doing some work yourself, you can buy a fixer-upper, and my informational links will tell you more about fixing one yourself. This conserves the trains' power supply for their needs and makes troubleshooting much easier. Classic Toy Trains 5-Year Collection 2015-2019 DVD-ROM. The first Lionel electric trains were powered by wet-cell batteries, which were, of course, dangerous. If you have a starter set and have had thoughts like this, youre not alone. They are known as HO train sets because they are half the size of O-guage. As you progress with your layout there are a lot of people here who will help you with any questions you have. Ran 6 motors [MPC's]. The power supply that comes with these sets is usually a very small wall pack plug-in that cannot be easily expanded. "O" Gauge is what Lionel is today, along with "O27". If youre looking for Lionel transformer comparisons, youve come to the right place. Lionel Rolling Stock Identification Guide. I went to mth Z1000, jason's train shop has the best price's I have seen for these. Like tankist stated.It's only running multiple engines that I run into issues. This thing has more power then I will ever need. A solid and stranded wire of the same gauge will be the same total diameter. Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Lionel Model Railroad and Train Transformers Best Selling Lionel 1908080 O Gauge CW80 Transformers - Black (4) $147.85 New $110.00 Used Lionel Legacy Powermaster Lnl637146 (13) $134.99 New $90.00 Used Lionel 634120 TMCC Direct Lock-On Transformer - Silver (21) $58.99 New $49.99 Used Lionel is also introducing a new 180 watt transformer to accompany the 80 watt CW 80.